Anyone seen this?

[jarandhel]

http://fairycongress.com/

It looks pretty new age, but taking a look at the workshops scheduled was interesting. As far as I can tell, there's no direct otherkin connection (at least no direct mention of otherkin on their website as far as I see), but Orion Foxwood endorsed it and he's the guy who made the Faery Cairn at Four Quarters and some folks in the otherkin community are friends with him.

Interesting idea, anyway.

Comments

[nabuca]

Dude...you're kidding me, right? Please tell me this is all a joke.

What a bunch of fucking idiots.

~Solo, LMAO

[jarandhel]

Nope, just a look at what other communities are doing.

[arethinn]

Um. This seems a bit harsh when it sounds like you haven't seen it before. RJ Stewart is a "fucking idiot"?

[nabuca]

I've seen at least one of the presenters in person (I was not impressed) and I've never been too particularly thrilled about either. I've also been through the entire website, just to be sure, to give it a chance. Honestly it gives me the same bad, dirty, skeezy feel about it.

I also don't think that supporting a convention or gathering that invites presenters who rip off Native traditions for monetary gain (judging from the website of one "Medicine Eagle") when many tribal peoples, such as those living on Lakota reservations, are living in abject poverty is a very good or ethical idea (run on sentence ftw). This only encourages the propagation of commonly held myths and racism rampant in the newage communities.

To add that, there are way too many factual and historical errors to even count listed on that page. Thankfully, by scrolling down in this thread, I'm not the only one who picked it up.

[arethinn]

. I've also been through the entire website, just to be sure, to give it a chance. Honestly it gives me the same bad, dirty, skeezy feel about it.

*shrugs* OK. Fair enough, to each their own. I don't get that from it. (And as I said I am convinced of the quality of RJ and Orion, although I don't have information to form an opinion on anyone else I saw skimming the list.)

invites presenters who rip off Native traditions for monetary gain (judging from the website of one "Medicine Eagle")

Brooke Medicine Eagle is a pretty BNP with considerable history. Whether she does what you say here, especially without having any such heritage herself, I don't know (I have not read anything she's written nor gone to anything she's presented).

[jarandhel]

At least with regard to Brooke Medicine Eagle, he seems to have a point: http://www.sonomacountyfreepress.com/features/brooke-edwards.html

I'm rather surprised that RJ Stewart and Orion endorse an event that she's part of, given her history.

[arethinn]

I wouldn't say "new age" exactly, at least if RJ Stewart and Orion Foxwood are involved, as they're quite far from New Age IME (my experience being probably about five PCon workshops with Orion and about that many with RJ, plus two? three? other small-group workshops with RJ outside a con environment). I've always found the name of this event a bit twee eyebrow-raising, yes, but FWIW it's something I would love to be able to go to one of these years. However, that's more with my pagan/witchy hat on than with my otherkin hat wings on.

I wouldn't think to include it in an otherkin links/resources list unless you are building a section on "other things that may be of interest / places you might find otherkin even though not specifically oriented to that topic" or something.

[arethinn]

my experience being probably about five PCon workshops with Orion and about that many with RJ

Plus reading, of course, probably eight or ten of RJ's books and both of Orion's (that I'm aware of).

[jarandhel]

In my experience, the term "Deva" is mainly used to refer to nature spirits in the more new-age traditions these days, based on the theosophical work "The Kingdom of the Gods" by Geoffrey Hodson and later influences such as the Findhorn and Perelandra materials, both of which are specifically mentioned on the presenters page. Neither classic faery lore nor paganism would have been familiar with the term. Add in the presenters who are channelers, practices such as "starlight master attunements" (and, btw, it looks like I was wrong about not explicitly mentioning otherkin, this workshop says that "We will also explore why we came to Earth as fairies in human form and what we still need to do to complete our missions."), the references to vibrations and multidimensionality, orb photography, etc... a lot of the focus and terminology seem explicitly new age to me. Less new-age stuff is interspersed, certainly, and I'd probably include both RJ Stewart and Orion Foxwood in that, but overall it strikes me as more newage than not. Just IMO, of course.

I wasn't thinking of adding it to the links list, I'm not putting any events there (they can go in the event forum instead). Just was curious who had seen it and what they thought.

[aerin]

My immediate reaction is a wincing, "Oh, that's newage, all right" thought. I don't know... maybe it's really a great, non-fluffy event, and maybe it's really eye-roll-inducing, participation by Orion Foxwood and the like aside.

[jarandhel]

*shrugs* Dunno. It seems more new-age themed to me, and that does tend to make me roll my eyes a lot, but I sometimes wonder how much stuff we miss by dismissing the more new-age communities that share traits in common with otherkin. For instance, a while back I came across something called "The Wanderer's Handbook", a fairly newage look at "ETs" incarnating into human bodies and similar concepts. It's honestly fairly painful to wade through if you don't like the new-age system. But interspersed in it, you find things like: "I believe this is an important point. We may not have always been on Earth, but we incarnated here as Earth natives, people of the blood and dust of this native sphere, subject to its requirements for departure. We will not get back to our home densities until we realize this and work to polarize enough for graduation from our present, third-density, experience."

Stripped of its new-age jargon, this is a sentiment found quite frequently among the higher-quality otherkin: we're human here and now, and we have to work at manifesting anything else we may also be.

There may be other useful material there, but honestly I've had a hard time wading through the jargon to find it if there is. That's more to do with my personal comfort level with the new-age system and its imagery than with the author or writing, though.

[aerin]

Very good point.

[dancinglights]

I wouldn't take some folks in the otherkin community being friends with Orion as anything like an endorsement by him of the concept, by the way. He's still rather hostile to it for good reason by bad examples, and those who get on with him do so by not bringing it up or, in Ri's case, having a very explicit agreement that they're coming from very different places and trying not to step on his terminology.

[jarandhel]

Oh, I know, I just meant there was a tangential connection there. I did find a more concrete connection reading through it, where one of the workshops mentions being fae in human bodies. Doesn't use the term otherkin, and not sure what system it's working with... possibly the Doreen Valente material?

[jarandhel]

Sorry, meant Virtue not Valente. The Earth Angels & Incarnate Elementals stuff.

[dancinglights]

Not familiar with it. I've a head full of Reclaiming and a surprisingly pleasant afternoon around Orion with an unsurprising inability to get through his written stuff recently, and that's about it.

[electricmoonshine]

This makes me sad.
Very, very sad.

[electricmoonshine]

(ps, did the Scots and the Scandinavians share their common Second Sight ceremonies and traditions with each other before or while they killed each other? Did the Celts refuse to pay the 65$ fee and that's why they had to leave? Questions, questions...)

[jarandhel]

Probably at the same time they shared other aspects of their culture. I'm not an expert, but there is historical evidence of periods of integration. From Wikipedia: "By the mid-ninth century the Norsemen had settled in Shetland, Orkney (the Nordreys- Norðreyjar), the Hebrides and Man, (the Sudreys- Súðreyjar - this survives in the Diocese of Sodor and Man) and parts of mainland Scotland. The Norse settlers were to some extent integrating with the local Gaelic population (see-Gall Gaidheal) in the Hebrides and Man."

Nor is Wikipedia the only source to talk about Scandinavian influence on Gaelic culture. An entire book has been written on the subject of how the Viking's influenced the developing English and Gaelic languages. Coupled with evidence of Scottish traditions like Hogmany that is believed to have been taken from the Scandinavian feast of Hoggo-nott, is it really that surprising that they would share other traditions in common?

[jarandhel]

Sorry, forgot to link to the stuff on Hogmany: http://www.rampantscotland.com/know/blknow12.htm

[electricmoonshine]

Oh, interesting! Stand corrected then!
(I still highly doubt those commonalities include 65$ second sight rituals for fairies and their friends, but you know. ;) )

[jarandhel]

I can't speak to the specific rituals being presented, but the concept of second sight did apparently come to Scotland from Scandinavia. http://www.jstor.org/pss/635926
And since the Scandinavian huldrefolk are considered equivalent to the Gaelic faeries, there is historical basis for connecting it with faerie traditions in both countries.
Seems fairly well researched overall, to me. As RJ Stewart generally is. Given that and his popularity as an author, it's not hard to see why it's commanding a steep price tag, especially since the price includes meals. And even at that price it's sold out.

[jarandhel]

*shrugs* It doesn't seem much worse than your average pagan gathering to me.

[electricmoonshine]

Oh my. Then those aren't for me, religious affiliation aside even.

[nabuca]

Dude jarin come on there have to be pagan gatherings that are better than this crap.

[jarandhel]

Try finding one. Seriously, this is about par for the course.

[enotsola]

That site/event especially does look a little newage, but RJ Stewart is one of the few people I've encountered that managed to snap my head around energetically just by asking a question from the audience during someone else's workshop at Pantheacon. The workshop of his I attended didn't actually seem to have the same force, somehow. Which my brain interpreted as ... more grounded in presenting than just being? I don't know. Words are more and more tricky these days, it seems. Stupid brain. Orion is another one that manages to break through my shell and make me think, at least in person. That man just has a presence that manages to get into my headspace in a way that engages me and tosses my skepticism aside until later. Although I don't hang on every word he says like most of the room usually seems to, I've taken something away from each workshop of his I've been to. I've been to kin events where I got less out of the weekend than I did of 10 minutes of a workshop from either RJ or Orion.

TLDR: I think what I'm trying to actually get at here is that even if this is completely new age fluff for most of it, it's like cotton candy with nutritional value.

[jarandhel]

I've found useful material in both of Orion's workshops that I've attended, but at the same time I've found myself annoyed by how much he name-drops in the course of a presentation. It snaps me away from focusing on the subject of the talk.

Agreed on having been to kin events where I've gotten less out of the weekend than one of his workshops, though. Don't know if I'd go as far as only ten minutes of them... but probably. ;-)

I agree there's definitely some nutritional value, but I can see Solo's point too if they're letting presenters like Brooke Medicine Eagle be involved.